Logic tells us that two thing are identical if and only if all their properties are the same. This case is quite rare apart from abstract philosophy and mathematics. So let’s say more practically two things are (approximately) the same if most of their essential properties are the same.

Now, what are the properties every christian (and possibly every jew and muslim) believe in that would qualify the identity of theirs gods?

The name? Well, ‘God’ is merely a classification rather than a name. Every monotheist could (and usually would) refer to his only god as ‘God’.

The appearance? The christian churches have any official image of their particular god (in contrast to the Hindu, the Buddhist sects and virtually all polytheists).

Ok, ‘God’ has no name and no appearance. Aren’t those properties by their own right? No, since no property can be defined completely by negation (logic again; not-red is no color).

Now of course there are plenty of other properties associated with the christian god(s): God is loving. God is cruel (Hiob). God is forgiving. God is vengeful. God will forgive you every sin – and you will be punished though. God is the bearded father in the sky. God is almighty and all-caring – but you better help yourself cause he will not. God is a paradox (being three distinct things at the same time; being his own father and son and some strange being from Plato’s idea space). God is the unmoved mover. God is stands outside the universe (the creation). God is part of our world. God has no appearance – only that men are made after his image.

I could go on for some time. But now, what are the properties every christian agrees upon that would establish the identity of god?

q.e.d.

I can imagine that many Jews think they are praying to a different god. Christianity’s conviction that Jesus was/is the messiah is just too far away for Jews, as are several other assets of christian belief. Nevertheless, Christianity is convinced (or read: the Bible says) that its god is the god of the Jews, “Yahweh”. If we’re just looking at the facts it does not matter if the Jews accept that or don’t.

My point was that one has to discern between faith in god and religious/christian branches. I think we share quite the same opinion, but the sentences quoted seemed too much of a generalization to me. You are certainly right that this was a rant against the catholic church. But not a rant against believers in god, drawing a connection between them and molesters. It may yet be a little unfair as there are lots of good people in this church as well, yet they have to push for justice. As I pointed out with my example, even when a priest/monk molested a child, he is only sent to another monastery where he may continue his deeds – no therapy etc.

Now I see from your explanation that you only meant conservative catholics and not all belieers – then I can only agree. Supporting such an institution can best be described with the German “Kadavergehorsam”. It would be far better to stand up for children’s rights. But I guess it is extremely hard to form an inner opposition in the church and far easier to distance oneself.

To my background: I have worked for the catholic church for about 7 years, long years as altar server, shortly as instructor and then one year as a helper in the boarding school of a monastery.

This church that covers molesters can not be trusted and must be a shame for every roman catholic. I wonder how anyone can continue to have faith in that organisation.

I could willingly try to misinterpret this as “rant” as well :) ….

I don’t see fairness issues, for the following reasons:
People who believe in a God but don’t follow the Catholic doctrine tell you that they believe in God, but in “another” God, a “different” God. And most Jews will also tell you that they pray to a different God than the Christians.

So I’m not trying to overgeneralize here. I specifically talked about conservative Catholics who belief that the Pope is indoctrinated by God, who follow the Catholic belief system and support this very church with their very money. Which is, I belief, the same group of people you refer to with your hard words (which are completely adquate, as far as I’m concerned).

I have been working in the Christian church for 5 years, leading two youth groups – it was a great time, and I met great people there. Of course many religious people are completely awesome – but that’s not what I’m talking about here.